[Hummingbird] Can’t clear cache due to permissions

Changes I’m making on my site aren’t reflected on the site because I can’t clear the cache. I have applied “font-display: swap;” to the css files, but nothing changes in the test.

  • Adam Czajczyk
    • Support Gorilla

    Hello Delbert Young

    I hope you’re well today and thank you for your question!

    I checked the site and I think there are actually two issues here that are involved in the case. First one is the cache clearing issue.

    I’ve accessed site and server and checked permissions and they seem good enough. Cache files are also created so if they are – that’s enough for clearing cache as well. What your host suggested (changing permission of a “file that clears cache”:wink: is not relevant here because it’s not the way WordPress works.

    However, I noticed something else that seems relevant. I have temporarily enabled Page Caching in Hummingbird and there was debugging enabled. When I tried to download Page Cache debug log file, I was also directed to a bit unexpected URL that resulted in 404 not found. But the file is where it should be.

    I will need some help from our developers then so I’ve asked them to check the site. They will access it and check the configuration, including folders/files on server to find out why this is happening and we’ll update you here once we only get to know more.

    I also mentioned that there seem to be two issues – the second one would be that “font-display” filter of Elementor. When I accessed the site I noticed that Page Cache in Hummingbird was actually disabled. When it’s disabled, it simply doesn’t work so it cannot “block” that filter that you added.

    I have, however, seen another similar issue just today – on a completely different site where no Hummingbird cache was involved at all. This filter didn’t seem to work there either. I went through Elementor docs but couldn’t find anything helpful and I suspect that what their solution might not be fully functional in fact. I’m not entirely sure but, as said, it’s the second case today that I see of an attempt to use that Elementor filter – that didn’t work – so this makes me think that it might not be as efficient as expected yet. It might actually be worth getting in touch with Elementor team and asking them for some additional explanation/advice on how this is supposed to work exactly.

    Kind regards,
    Adam

  • Delbert Young
    • WPMU DEV Initiate

    Thank you very much. I have another WordPress site I created before Elementor became popular. Hummingbird got that site to a score of 100. I feared my problem could be something to do with Elementor since I can’t get this site above 45, and the primary difference in how it’s built is I’m using Elementor here. Once we’ve done all we can with Hummingbird and something still isn’t correct, I will contact Elementor.

  • Adam Czajczyk
    • Support Gorilla

    Hi Delbert Young

    I have another WordPress site I created before Elementor became popular. Hummingbird got that site to a score of 100. I feared my problem could be something to do with Elementor since I can’t get this site above 45, and the primary difference in how it’s built is I’m using Elementor here.

    It most likely does affect the score/performance to some degree but I don’t think this alone is the reason for such difference in the score between these two sites. In general, the way that’s scored (and what really affects performance) depends on so many different factors that it can only be assessed in context of a specific site.

    It’s also worth remembering that score can be but not really always is the “ultimate indication” of real performance. I’ve seen tons of sites with great score that were much slower than expected and equally lots of sites with not-so-great scores that were “fast as a wind” :slight_smile:

    Anyway, I fully agree with you – let’s first solve the Hummingbird’s issue and then we can give that Elementor’s font thing another try (I did some tests with the other case today so maybe it actually can work, at least partially) and after that – if that still doesn’t solve the font-display recommendation, it’ll be best to get in touch with Elementor.

    As for Hummingbird – since I’ve already asked our developers for help, we (I or one of my colleagues) we’ll update you here as soon as we get to know more from them and then we’ll decide (together with you) what to do next :slight_smile:

    Best regards,
    Adam

  • Delbert Young
    • WPMU DEV Initiate

    Thank you Adam. I appreciate your involvement. I do hope something can be tweaked in Hummingbird to get the score up on this site simply for my peace of mind’s sake. It bothers me because I can’t get it out of the 40s even though, as you mentioned about some sites, it doesn’t seem that slow.

    Thanks again,
    Delbert

  • Predrag Dubajic
    • Support

    Hi Delbert,

    I see that you have couple of YouTube vides embded on your home page and while those will affect loading times to certain amount the biggest issue seems to be related to your header video.
    This video is over 50MB and is having the biggest impact on the loading times from what I see.

    I would suggest starting by either removing that video completely or replacing it with a more optimized, web friendly, version that will not take up that much of your space.

    Once that is done you can continue with further site optimization but until your page is under 50MB there is not much that optimization can help with.

    Best regards,
    Predrag

  • Delbert Young
    • WPMU DEV Initiate

    Hi Predrag,
    I’ve removed the videos and replaced them with a slider. I’ve also changed the theme hoping it would help and it might have a little. Between everything I’ve done motivated by what you said, the page size is now 46.15 KB (https://smallseotools.com/website-page-size-checker/). According to Google Insights page speed, it’s only at 41 Mobile and 45 Desktop. It doesn’t seem Hummingbird is retaining my Asset Optimization settings either. This could have something to do with the permissions?

    Thanks,
    Delbert Young

  • Panos
    • SLS

    Hi Delbert Young !

    In regards to the issue not being able to clear cache, it seems it’s related that the file system method is set to ftpext. I have already reported that to main dev. Until we have news from the dev, I have applied a patch that seems to be allowing cache to be purged.

    Let us know if it still is not being cleared when you test it :slight_smile:

    Kind regards!

  • Delbert Young
    • WPMU DEV Initiate

    Thanks Panos,
    I’ve been away from the computer for a few hours. Before I left, I ran speed checks on the site. I removed all my ads and I wanted to see if doing this would help my speed. It was running around 50 on Desktop and 29 on Mobile prior to my removing the ads. After removing the ads, it ran 72 on Desktop and 56 on Mobile. I was sort of happy about that as that’s the highest it’s been. I ran another test after receiving your message. It’s now 35 on Desktop and 6 on Mobile according to Hummingbird’s test. According to Google Insights it’s 32 on Desktop and 8 on Mobile. It appears to be worse now if it is clearing the cache.

    Should we put it back until dev figures something out?

    Thanks for taking a look.

  • Panos
    • SLS

    I can remove that but Hummingbird devs confirmed the fix and it will be included in future releases. The change on the test results is not likely to have to do with this change. I checked and pages load cached but still the score was low. In gtmetrix it was 80% but I think they are using an old api version.

    I also tried moving some assets to footer but there was no real change. Since you get 3 free sites on our hosting as part of your membership may I suggest creating a copy of your site there so we can compare the scores and see if it’s hosting related?

    Kind regards!

  • Delbert Young
    • WPMU DEV Initiate

    Please remove it. I rechecked my score just now and my score is 7 Mobile and 30 Desktop. I can’t live with that. With Hummingbird and WPMU DEV disabled the score is 7 Mobile and 34 Desktop on Google Insights. Hummingbird is doing nothing with this patch. It was 56 Mobile and 72 Desktop before the patch.

    Thank you,

  • Panos
    • SLS

    I have removed it Delbert Young !

    Just want to note that this patch shouldn’t be affecting the scores. It simply allows the cache to be purged when the file system is not set to direct, as in your case it is set to ftpext.

    When a system is using cache it needs a way to clear it, in case there is an update in content. If the score did change indeed right after cache was cleared then it might be something related to updated content. Is there any chance you remember how long was the content cached and what changes have been while cached?

    Kind regards!

  • Delbert Young
    • WPMU DEV Initiate

    Hi Panos,
    I ran another speed test and the results were bad again, so obviously, as you said, the patch didn’t have anything to do with the speed. Crazy!
    To answer your question about how long since I cleared the cache, I’m thinking I probably cleared it, or tried to, before I installed Hummingbird. The history is I wasn’t getting the results I thought I should get, so I contacted tech support. They are the ones who said the cache wasn’t clearing and wrote the ticket. I have another site with a different host (Godaddy) getting into the 90’s on the speed test using the free version of Hummingbird. This site, lifegatechurch.com has never gotten a good score. I would do as you suggested and do a temporary copy to see if it’s a host problem, but the site is large! I don’t think there is enough room on the sites that comes with Hummingbird Pro. Plus, I don’t have a clue as to how to move it. I’ve been with this host (Webmasters) for years and never had a problem.
    Thank you for your concern and time. If you have any suggestions, I’d love to hear them.

    Delbert Young

  • Panos
    • SLS

    I believe it’s worth trying out different host and compare results to check if there is an improvement. Since you can have a free site on our host with your account you don’t have anything to lose for this test. :slight_smile:

    We could move your site to our host for you. You have already sent in admin and control panel access so that should be enough. I don’t see an option for ssh there which would make things faster. Let me know if there is ssh access but I missed that.

    You can go to your hub and from there click on the Hosting link. From there you can create a new site and give it a temp name:
    https://premium.wpmudev.org/hub/hosting/

    If you agree to above let us know so we can start with that

    Kind regards!

  • Delbert Young
    • WPMU DEV Initiate

    Thanks Panos,
    I would love to try what you suggested and see if testing the site on a your server would help. I am not aware of ssh on the site. I’ve never asked for it and don’t see it listed in the cPanel.

    This site was a html site. I converted it to WordPress and I built it in a WordPress sub folder. My intention was once I got it optimized to move it to primary. Instead of https://lifegatechurch.com/wordpress I want https://lifegatechurch.com/. Is this something we can do easily?

    Another concern I have is the site might exceed the size limit for a website in my host account. It’s a large site.

    Please instruct me concerning what I need to do next to accomplish what you suggested.

    Thanks again,

  • Delbert Young
    • WPMU DEV Initiate

    Hi Panos,
    I’ve been working with Hummingbird doing a lot of clicking and testing. I have the speed test on Hummingbird to 49 Mobile and 83 Desktop. On Google Insights the test is 50 Mobile and 85 Desktop. What I wanted to tell you is the primary Opportunity on Mobile is “Reduce server response times (TTFB)”. It’s 0.73 s. This would be exactly what you are telling me. The server isn’t as fast as it should be. The second Opportunity is “Eliminate render-blocking resources”. It’s 0.62 s. Under Diagnostics, one of the warning is “Serve static assets with an efficient cache policy.” This is probably what you fixed and I had you change back.

    I’m excited about getting it move to a test site so we can see how it performs.

    I wanted to update you.

    Thank you,

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