Paypal processing - make this simpler.

Dear M'ship Team,

There is a much simpler approach for paypal that I would recommend you implement forthwith.

Instead of asking people to put your URL in their IPN details on Paypal - which means that any other Paypal payment system they have will be rendered null and void (unless they have a Notify URL approach for those) you should use Notify URL in your form that goes to Paypal.

Since you know the return URL (you put it on the screen for us to copy to the IPN details) you can simply put this is as the Notify-URL parameter in the form. This would make it easier for us, and allow us to have multiple Paypal activities on the same account. It would also allow us to use both the Paypal Express and the Single Payment process.

The second issue is that you provide a very constrained selection of buttons. Given that most people want to have people Subscribe, then a Subscribe button is fine, BUT... for those of us who want people to Register, or Sign Up, or pay for something once-off, Subscribe doesn't do it really. We should have a choice, if fact we should be able to customise what is on the button, since it's just an image. Obviously, the back-offcie processing for hosted Paypal buttons needs to be invoked properly, but that is separate from what is written on the image.

I've also raised separately the fact that an INDEFINITE subscription, is not a subscription in the normal sense. It;s a once-off payment for a service or a product or something, so the user should NOT be told they will need to renew, or will be billed, in a year, or a day, or ten years, or whatever is in the period of the indefinite subscription. It is INDEFINITE, so it never ends. There should be no mention of any further payments or any time period at all.

These would be very useful change sot the system.

Thanks
JC

  • Jack Kitterhing

    Hi there JC,

    Hope you're well today! :slight_smile:

    Thanks for your valuable feedback here, I personally am working closely with the Membership developer on our major re-write we are currently developing.

    We have everything you have mentioned here on our roadmap :slight_smile:

    For PayPal, we'll be looking to implement their new API, though this might not make 4.0, as we have to take into accounts backwards compatibility, but we will be looking at getting that implemented.

    Also even though the standard gateway does mention the IPN URL, it should still assign the membership and work correctly, without specifically setting the IPN in PayPal, it did correctly just now when I tested in sandbox mode. :slight_smile:

    Thank you!

    Kind Regards
    Jack.

  • Jack Kitterhing

    Hi there JC,

    Hope you're well today! :slight_smile:

    I've done some tests just now on live and that also correctly added the membership, and my IPN was active but with the MarketPress return for the express checkout.

    Can I ask about the INDEFINITE sub? How will that operate?

    The indefinite sub will be one payment and will no longer mention any form of a subscription, how everything looks, access levels, how subscriptions are handled is being completely re-written. :slight_smile:

    Thank you!

    Kind Regards
    Jack

  • John

    Hi Jack

    Thanks for your reply - much appreciated.

    Actually, I looked at the code again and it does contain the notify URL - doh!!! So it should work fine.

    Somehow it didn't work for the Paypal Standard checkout, but it did work for the Single Payment checkout - and I changed the IPN in between, but that looks like a red herring now.

    When I go to my site.com/pyapalreturns/paypalsolo/ I get this message:
    Error: Missing POST variables. Identification is not possible.

    When I go to my site.com/pyapalreturns/paypal/ I just go to my home page.

    On the INDEFINITE subs - they pay for a product, and they get indefinite access to the material that supports the product, plus a bunch of bonuses from time to tie - so their subscription is important, because I have about 40 different access levels on the site - so I don't want them to get access to other products accidentally.

    Hope this helps in your planning.

    Can you give me any insights as to why the payment gateway might work for one but not the other? I can always do more testing - but I'm trying to launch as well.

    Thanks - JC

  • John

    Hi Jack

    I can't see any IPN history at all - nothing comes up.

    In my payment history, I have the following:

    12 Jul 2014 Payment From John Cunningham Completed Details Payment From John Cunningham 6PW38596TN451292B Issue refund $1.00 -$0.32 $0.68 USD
    12 Jul 2014 Recurring Payment From John Cunningham Completed Details Recurring Payment From John Cunningham 5MJ11344Y6282513T Issue refund $1.00 -$0.32 $0.68 USD
    12 Jul 2014 Recurring Payment From John Cunningham Expired Details Recurring Payment From John Cunningham ... ... ...
    12 Jul 2014 Recurring Payment From John Cunningham Created Details Recurring Payment From John Cunningham

    You can see (going from bottom to top) that I did one payment using the standard gateway, and that failed.
    Then I did a second payment with the standard gateway that processed, but I didn't get an IPN at the App. What I did get was a two-part transaction - a recurring payment followed by a cancellation of the recurring part.
    Then I did a transaction with the Single payment gateway - and it processed normally.

    Let me know if I can provide anything else.
    I will try another couple of tests with the standard gateway, but I don't know why I can't see the IPNs from the last transaction at all. I know they processed because the subscription and access levels changed.

    Cheers
    JC

  • John

    Thanks for the response Jack.

    I've turned on access so you can have a play.

    I'm working in the website so things might move around a bit, but not in the payments area :slight_smile:

    Did you see the post from Michael Bissett?

    Hey @John,
    Upon further investigation, I found something interesting. There is one situation where the the expiration notice for a infinite duration subscription shows up to an end user.
    It's when the "PayPal Single Payments Gateway" is employed for a subscription (see screenshot below). With any other gateway, that message doesn't pop up, it only says:

    You are on an indefinite membership.
    The code that tipped me off to this possibility was located in lines 307-308 of membership/classes/Membership/Render/Page/Subscription/Renew.php, with the mention of "$gatewayissingle".

    I've notified our developers here, so that they can have a further look, and see what can be done about this.
    Regards - Michael

    That may have some overlapping effect somewhere :slight_smile:

    I had a second issue pop up this morning - I should raise a ticket for it, but I installed Reader and it came up with an error that required me to edit the file and deactivate the plugin. Should I raise a ticket?

    Cheers
    JC

  • Jack Kitterhing

    Hi there JC,

    Hope you're well today! :slight_smile:

    I have a theory here after checking your settings, I see your applying a default membership to the new users, I believe is applying and this not correctly allowing the plugin to apply the indefinite membership using the standard gateway. Can you try removing that and see where we are on then? :slight_smile:

    And it also seems and what you found out in the other backs this up a bit more is that PayPal single is the one to use with indefinite and standard wasn't designed to, which does seem rather odd.

    I had a second issue pop up this morning - I should raise a ticket for it, but I installed Reader and it came up with an error that required me to edit the file and deactivate the plugin. Should I raise a ticket?

    If you could raise a ticket that would be great, as that certainly shouldn't be happening, I've tried to replicate that without any luck.

    Thank you!

    Kind Regards
    Jack.

  • John

    Hi Jack

    I changed the setting check-box to off where it says:

    Assign first subscription level to new users
    Added on new user registration only

    I left the default as Visitor in the box above this though.

    I think the other issue about Reader has been resolved - they made a quick change to make sure it could't be applied to a Single Site implementation - so I don't think I need to raise a ticket now.

    I am going to start a new thread on "View Site As" though. I have 40 access levels, and they don't all fit on the page, so I can't see them all.

    Cheers - JC

  • Jack Kitterhing

    Hi there JC,

    Hope you're well today! :slight_smile:

    I changed the setting check-box to off where it says:

    Assign first subscription level to new users
    Added on new user registration only

    I left the default as Visitor in the box above this though.

    Is that now working correctly for you? :slight_smile:

    I think the other issue about Reader has been resolved - they made a quick change to make sure it could't be applied to a Single Site implementation - so I don't think I need to raise a ticket now.

    Fantastic! Glad to hear that's working correctly for you now! :slight_smile:

    If we can assist please don't hesitate to ask, we're here to help.

    Thank you!

    Kind Regards
    Jack.

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